Protecting Your Rights as a Nurse with Maggie Ortiz

Season 4
Written By Quaas Beth

Maggie Ortiz has been a nurse for over 23 years, working in various roles, including bedside nursing, administration, and as an investigator for the Texas Board of Nursing. Throughout her career, she learned how to protect herself from litigation and offers help to nurses facing difficult situations. Maggie created Advocates for Nurses to educate nurses on navigating these types of situations from a nurse's perspective.

This season, Maggie returns to share insights into how nurses can protect themselves, offer helpful tips, and provide personal connections to those facing potential issues regarding their license. She also teaches courses for nurses to learn how to protect themselves while caring for patients.

ABOUT MAGGIE

Maggie is a champion for nursing empowerment. Advocate Maggie, is a seasoned ICU nurse with an extensive 25-year career dedicated to nursing excellence. Her journey began in the heart of healthcare, navigating the complexities of the ICU environment. With a profound commitment to nursing advocacy, Maggie stands tall as a relentless force for positive change. Her wealth of experience spans various facets of nursing, empowering her with insights and wisdom that resonate deeply within the nursing community.

Beyond the clinical setting, Maggie is a fierce advocate for nurses' rights, recognition, and professional growth. Her passion fuels discussions and initiatives aimed at fostering a more empowered and respected nursing profession.

Advocate Maggie's mission is clear: to uplift, inspire, and empower nurses across the spectrum. Through her advocacy efforts and unwavering dedication, she continues to be a driving force in shaping the future of nursing. Join Advocate Maggie on her journey to champion nursing empowerment and celebrate the invaluable contributions of nurses everywhere.

LINKS

  • Beth Quaas

    Hello everyone and welcome back to don't eat. You're young. I'm your host, Beth cross. I am so happy that you're here today to listen. And I encourage you to go on to wherever you listen to this podcast and leave a review for me. Your rating? I would be so appreciate. Today I'm so excited to have Maggie Ortiz back on the show. She was here last season and I'm so excited to bring her back. She's doing so much to encourage nurses and educating them on their rights and their protections and where they can go if they need help. So I welcome back to the show. Maggie Ortiz. Maggie, it is so nice to have you back again. Tell us what you've been doing.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Well, always nice to be back. So where to begin? Where to begin? I actually had a pretty great year. I, you know, this is my first month. 2023 was my actual. Just like first year being out there as an entrepreneur, as a next entrepreneur, which can be kind of scary. I mean leaving. The bedside I could save. A life. But some of this.

    Other Techy stuff or getting out there.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Can be a little bit more difficult, but I've had I've been well received. Wrote a book help. I'm a nurse. I'm being deposed. That one kindle. Amazon. Is it the end ought to be all. It's not. And I didn't realize that there were some. You know difficulties. With getting that on Amazon and having that you know. Just touching it and. Getting it to a nurse and you have to have Kindles. A lot of learning curves there, but it is on Amazon because when a nurse comes to me and they're in civil litigation, which is different than administrative and criminal, we're we're not talking because you're not saying my name within the first five to seven, 7 minutes of your deposition. Who prepped you? No, that's your legal team's responsibility, not mine. But it can be scary for a nurse. 'Cause, they don't know what. What's a plaintiff? What's the defense? What superiors respondents. So I just break it down with just definition. So it's an educational piece for a nurse. You know, throwing some weighty stuff, some stats because, you know, people want to know that stuff and then tying it a little bit too, like, it could also end up in front of a board of nursing. But I'm not a lawyer. I never give legal. Advice but it's. Just my way of trying to give a nurse. You know something in 20 pages that they can use, you know the. Risk manager reached out to them. Hey, no big deal.

    Come on down. Here there's a legal case that you're involved in. No, no biggie. Don't sweat it. And they're like, wait, what?

    Beth Quaas

    Remind us. So you had a very short stint on the Texas Board of Nursing as an investigator. Remind us a little bit about that period and how it brought you to what you're doing now.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Sure. So great question, great question. So that is what kind of brings me to advocates for nurses. Advocate Maggie, is that I did spend a short period of time as an investigator and I was seeing some things that I concerns about. I didn't know law. I wasn't. I was trained as an investigator, but I was like, oh, I'm so how many staff were there? No, no, no, no. Just, you know, keep moving forward. I just felt like nurses. You know, and I'm skipping over lots of stuff there. We're not being extended. What I now know, a decade later, to be due process, and I'm not the only one who speaks up about this. So I spent a short time there, came back on out, went back to the Cath lab. I was comfortable. US legal nurse consultant reached out to me and said, hey, I have a civil case. Would you look at it? And I was like, yes, full transparency. So then I crossed over, became civil expert for short period of time and now I do administrative expert work or advocacy where I help nurses and their legal teams when they're under investigation. So just under administrative law, which is any. A person with a license. It's your privilege to practice it. Doesn't this have to be a traditional board? It could be HHS, DHS, the governor, ALJ. Just I have become intimate with that process and it changed my life. So I'm. I'm just called. To this space. To help educate our people so you understand the Board of Nursing. Its mission is not. To protect us, it's to protect the public.

    Beth Quaas

    I I love that I love the work that you're doing and you freely give up your phone number to nurses to reach out to you at any.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I do just because I'm. I'm called to something bigger than myself, and when they're sleeping in their car or they get that letter, it's like getting a cancer diagnosis. Right. And it's it's can be very nerve wracking. So yes and sometimes. You know their legal team as well only has a certain amount of time that they can spend with them. No disrespect to the lawyer. I'm. I'm going to be going to law school, but their time is limited and or their knowledge of the Board of Nursing because maybe they're not a nurse. I have a different knowledge base. I've had lawyers reach out to me because I was with an agency. So what I had to learn as an investigator with an agency is very different. So I created tools for nurses, some handouts as well about being under investigation. And one of those gifts I do give them is my phone number because. I don't want them. To struggle alone. It can be very scary. And you know anyone who's been in this a. Nurse for a hot minute. We see. These people's names in the quarterly magazine or handout and. We all make assumptions. As did I prior to spending some time at that board, are there nurses in that hand out that did stuff? Yes. Not why? I'm not going to say no. But do they deserve a due process? They do, and that's where I come in. And sometimes it's just knowing what does it mean to be under investigation? What are my rights. And so that's my gift to nurses to help them, you know, along with the group and then doing my tick tocks cause that's the last place I want you to be, but yes. My e-mail phone number. Yes. Please don't. Don't struggle alone. You are not alone.

    Beth Quaas

    So when that nurse like you mentioned gets that call from HR. Come on down. We just want to have a conversation. What's your number? One piece of advice to that nurse?

    Maggie Ortiz

    It will be on your schedule. It will not be while you're on the clock and then you need to have the full access to the full medical record. The organization is not your friend to a certain degree, but they're also don't want to be involved in. Litigation, right. So they're that door for them, swings both.

    Ways that to.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Protect themselves, but they don't want you to be.

    Involved because that involves them.

    Maggie Ortiz

    You know, So what does that mean? So, but you have rights like if you're involved in something, then yes. I want to look the medical record. And it's not gonna be why I'm on the clock. Because you're not gonna rush me. You're not gonna sit here and rush me? No. I will be sitting down there and then if? You open up the medical record. As the nurse, what's the first thing you're doing? You're going into writing a note. I'm reviewing this medical record. For what? What is the case number, Sir? Because if.

    They if you're.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Being deposed, it's there's a petition. It's there's a. There's a case. There's nothing wrong with that. You're just. Keeping it very. Unbiased opening medical record to review for deposition and whatever number that is sitting here with. I'm sorry. What's your name? All the where, Jack?

    Yes, yes, but.

    Maggie Ortiz

    And that's when I'm writing and then I'm. I'm. Then I'm going through the medical record. What is I I. Want to see the? Petition as well as the nurse. What is a petition? The petition is like an allegation or a claim. Why is there a case is basically what that means. So if you're under, if you're being called. Down and there's you're gonna possibly depose. Don't you want to know? The case is about possibly or where originated from, so it is. Your right to. Have that petition, so I would be asking for a petition and sure.

    Yes, attorney Jake. When I'm off, I. Will be more than happy.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I am off on Tuesday. At this time, and I'll be. More than happy. To come down to your office, yes. Sir and you? Don't. This is just for you to review. A medical record? Not for you to say. Oh, you're being opposed. Ohh no I'll let. You know when I'm ready for. That that will be on my schedule as well. Thank you, Jake.

    Beth Quaas

    That is such good advice because. I would say, well, years ago when I was less experienced, I probably would have run right down and answered anything they wanted and said, Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I can't believe this happened and. You're saying slow down. Take your time. It's really your schedule.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yes. Yeah. And I think I would have been the same and a lot of nurses do the same thing and that's you. Know not to go. Back to the book. But that's why I talk about is what it was. Even when you're being. Asked a question. You're always in control. This needs to be under what you are comfortable with, right? It's OK for you to ask the. Attorney. So I don't really understand what this means.

    Can you just help me walk?

    Maggie Ortiz

    And and what are my rights? Do I have rights? You do. And that you need to understand but. When there's a medical malpractice case that's civil litigation, different from administrative, which is the board of Nursing. Differ from CRM. You know, those don't necessarily just because there's a civil case doesn't necessarily mean that the board of Nursing case and or that there's a criminal case, but do know that they can originate from that civil case. If you are found negligent in that civil case and what you do and are not say in that deposition. Right can cross over to the border nursing. And if you are found negligent. And civil, you do under most instances have to close that. And what does that look like normally under your renewal it will ask you a question about. Possible litigation to include civil. And so that's where they. Get you is on your renewal or your full endorsement when you go to another state.

    Beth Quaas

    Well, that's good to know. So at what point? When you maybe ask to come down, you know, like you said, the hospitals, the facilities, the nursing homes, wherever you work, they have lawyers and at what point do you need your own representation outside of that facility?

    Maggie Ortiz

    Tells you. You tells me you recognize. That there is a. Conflict of interest, and that's a great question. So am I the primary nurse or did I just do a? Blood sugar on. That patient, that's the only reason why my name. Is in the chart. If I'm the primary nurse and that patient is now deceased. I would be really I would be going down to speak to the lawyer on my time and it may need. You may need a day or two because it's it's very nerve wracking and that's OK that's OK you need to do this on. Your own schedule there. Lack of planning is. Not your emergency. The trial could be pushed back. There's lots of things. Don't worry about the timeline. If you need a week even to digest that before you have the nerve to even walk into HR. Wherever the. Lawyer lives. That's OK. So then you go down and you speak to. Them it's going if. Even a nurse for 5 minutes going. To come to. Fruition what this is looking. Like I only just fill this out to you. Patient died. You were the last one to touch the patient. There's lacks of lacking documentation. I would probably be thinking about getting my own legal counsel. Because who's cutting that lawyer? That check if you have medical malpractice, or if you have liability insurance, it will get you a medical malpractice lawyer and administrative lawyer. But again, for the most part, that. Hospital organization doesn't want to see you go down because then that ties them to some negligence because you are their employee. And that can you know that can be right to this level of gross negligence. So are they trying to necessarily always throw you over under the bus? No. But when it comes down to the nutcracking, it comes down to you or them who do you. Think they're gonna let you fall? Who? Who? Who's going to fall right and then? You need to take those things into consideration. And then you know, I can't give you the answer to that necessarily, but I hope that you start to realize that you know, I was the last person to touch the patient. This person is no longer here. You know, I have all these physicians here that are called and they have lawyers and they're going to be testifying against me. I I might want to have my own legal representation.

    Beth Quaas

    And I think that's something. If someone were to get in touch with you that you would help them navigate that time and and when to move forward with something like that.

    100%.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Absolutely. Because and even sometimes the things that you do or do not say, because that can actually be, you know, sent right over to the board of nursing, right. And what can be taken extrapolate that because you're in front of a jury, it's theater in civil cases, right? Because not everything is going to be admissible different than the Board of Nursing. So you said some stuff that could be taken out of context. All the evidence was, you know, provided there and now that deposition is literally copied and pasting this public record. Sent over to the Board of Nursing. So I just remind nurses, you know, you're speaking with the lawyer.

    Maggie Ortiz

    You're setting up a time to speak with them to go over. The medical record if. At the time you decide that you want your own legal representation, that's when. You would let the. Hospital lawyer know I'm going to get my own legal representation. Then you put things on pause and then that's when you. You know, get with that lawyer and then you guys are going to go over the medical record or anything. Evidence based science, that's when you would want the full complete file, whatever they have any discoverable. Evidence so discoverable means anything that the other side has to include. That expert nurse is going to be testifying against you. All of it. So that you get that you can review that before you are deposed.

    Beth Quaas

    That's great information. And if nothing else, just to have somebody totally on your side. Yes, it wants to help you and and not like we said, not that the hospital doesn't want to help you. But again they have their own things to protect.

    Correct, correct.

    Beth Quaas

    Well, I'm so excited that you are going back to school to become a lawyer because. There cannot be too many nurses in this country that also have their JD do you, is that correct?

    Maggie Ortiz

    I believe so, I I. Couldn't spew that number off the top of my head, but I don't believe it's a huge number. I don't believe there's a huge number of women. And what are we predominantly women, so. That there it. Is so yeah, it's have to do it.

    Beth Quaas

    I love that. What? What a gap. That you will fill and you know. Will you know the Board of Nursing and how they run? At least in Texas. And I know that you've done research on other states as well and you are a wealth of information. So to have someone in that space that knows what we do is going to be. So fantastic.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I do think that there is a deficiency and that is the other reason that spurred me, you know, was an ER Doctor Who? Was just like. Us what are you waiting for? And. I was like well. So the ill set and he was like this. The test he was like, stop.

    And I was like, well, I'm. I'm old, I'm.

    Maggie Ortiz

    50 he's like I'm 73. So next what? What? Was your answer and I was like, alright, I he was like you. Were called to this space you already. Doing the work. So it's it. Is time, so I it is time.

    Beth Quaas

    What grassroots things are you working on right now?

    Maggie Ortiz

    So I'm doing some charting courses and teaching nurses and charting stuff just because like I just talked about. You're sitting in front with the lawyer, and now we're looking at what did I just say? The documentation what you did. Or did not document so I got I'm I'm. Able to do. CE for the charting courses that I'm doing, so I'm doing like charting Tuesday in January and then teaching class at 7:00 PM Central Standard Time just because. And that's what I that's what nurses keep asking me for is the documentation course, because what do I know in all three types of litigation? What's the one thing that we're going to look at and not necessarily for a criminal case, but if it was related to, like, a medication error that led to? Possibly a death. What are we all going to look at? The medical records what you did or did not? Document and then with the you know with just with COVID and then these nurses not getting some of the real time ability to to like chart for you know in an EMAR or on paper because they. We're in SIM. Labs. So there's that, you know, huge deficiency. The nursing Coalition I completed that this year, getting nurses together to brainstorm because again, we're trying to find some grass. Stuff to hold some boards accountable. So still working on some of that, I collaborated with some great nurses and learned some stuff and it's every state, just like you said. I've helped either an attorney or a nurse in every, you know, single state. Some are worse than others. So collaborating with some other people because it. Can't just be me. It has to be, you know, 5 or 10 people in each state and then you know. We, like we talked about, we are 5. Million strong. We can make change. But it has to be each one of us going to our representatives. So I created some tools like how do I reach my representative? Well, OK, just Google, who represents me. So I created some of those tools on my website with some short, like maybe a direct message or an e-mail that you can just copy and paste and kind of draft just a little bit. Change to send to your representative. So that's something that I created

    Beth Quaas

    That's so incredible for nurses to have that, so that they know what to do and. A personalized written message goes a long way versus. Just clicking on something that is generic and and I've seen it work and so I love what you're doing because it really does help. And like you said, 5 million, we can make things happen.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yeah, and it was a in Texas here and I don't know the bill they passed where an APR has to be called if an APR is under investigation.

    Beth Quaas

    Really, 2023?

    Maggie Ortiz

    So those kind of things do. Matter. I'm just going. To leave that there, but it wasn't. A PR group that had their lobbyist, you know, champion and that kind. Of stuff, but it it. Will take. All of us. It cannot just be one of us. So just like you said, people don't underestimate our people, underestimate the power of our representatives. Because all you have to say is. Hey, I'm your. Constituent and you know who I'm like to hit up first is the nurses and the physicians because they they're our peers. You stand in front of them and you tell them I was zipping someone up every hour and a body bag, a body bag last year and I didn't get workman's comp or and or every other nurses assaulted. And that's two an hour and there's no bill. In the. State why? Why is that? You know, the Dallas nurse that got shot in the face, the social worker, and we don't have, you know, metal detectors. But by God, the Dallas Stadium does tell me about that.

    Beth Quaas

    I love that yes. Why is that? Why is that?

    Maggie Ortiz

    It's all optics and you know what it is? It's not about us and only. Take the nurses. Out of it. How about the patients? You know, that was a. Labor and delivery. Room in Dallas. The labor and delivery unit in Dallas, right, and this and no disrespect this, this young man.

    Beth Quaas

    I remember that story.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Had an ankle bracelet on and I'm not saying you should be able to see your child, but not at the hospital. You've made some choices in your life, right? And again, there are people at risk here and because of that, that isn't you're then you're not able to come in this building right now. What you guys do when she goes. Home here. You know, in a day or two is, you know, but you don't get to come. In this building, right? That's just how it works, and had that been in place. He would have lurked it. He had a gun on him, right? And then maybe some of that. Stuff you know. That, that, that. They would be here today.

    Beth Quaas

    Completely agree and they tried to pass legislation in Minnesota with staffing ratios and. It throughout the hospitals in Minnesota and it didn't make it through because one of the well, the biggest health system in Minnesota, threatened to take a big expansion outside of our state. And so it was shot down. So that tells you, is it about the money or about the patient?

    Maggie Ortiz

    Science. It's all science, and there's not one study that supports not having enough of us. I can tell you. On the civil. And the Board of Nursing side failure to respond. Let me just tell you about that. And now I had, you know, four patients in the ICU. And you and I both. Know that's not appropriate. You know you have a. Nurse that says. You know, I have four patients in the unit. Try responding to someone who's maxed out on pressors. I'm in this other room with this. Other patients unstable, they're maxed out on pressers. I should be two to one instead of four to one, and now I miss something and they have a bad outcome. And now that family reports me every nurse I want you to know. You cannot say. My hospital made me. No, they did not. And I don't, I don't, you know, again, easy for me to say, but let me just tell you their nurses who got their ankle bracelets off right. And if they can't, if that. Hospital cannot staff that. Unit and or that facility I can assure you they're still doing elective cases. I can assure you they've not gone in diversion. I can assure you they've not moved anyone where they need to be. So don't. Tell me they've exhausted all the rest. Courses no, because you're placing me and my license and my ability to. Support my family. At risk, your lack of planning, we're here. Because of them. Right. And we have to stop normalizing.

    That right there.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I use things like 217 one S&TSOS is you making me making the assignment tease me accepting the assignment. Are you asking me? To do that, the. Definition of medical malpractice and I'll. Both the Texas Nurses Association lawyer whom said I. Asked this question. Knowingly and willingly taking on an unsafe assignment is that the definition. Of medical malpractice, it sure is. Don't tell me that they're making you, because again, they're not and my.

    Beth Quaas

    Mic drop.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Biggest thing is that you. Have to be part of the solution. What did the schedule say? 30 days ago. How long did you know? And I'm not telling you that some of the stuff I'm telling you is right. I'm just telling you where you are, right? Now and you have. To introduce yourself to the position that they put us in and us too, because. We too have stood by and done nothing. We have to own. Our piece of it. As well, we have stood by and just been like because we're the moms. We're the sisters, we're the nurses of. World, we're just. We just want to show up and do good things and then we just expect everyone else around us to like, do the right thing and then, you know, we didn't go to the Capitol, we didn't. You know, there's only small part of us who were willing to do those kind of things that make change. So part of it we do have to own where we are at as well. But then. That being said. Now every one of us has to stand up and say. No, we don't shame other nurses on the floor. We all stand united if one of us has. A concern all. Of us has concerned we don't isolate any of us because even it it may not even be valid, right? It could be something so ridiculous, but then. That's when education. You take their hand. You're like, OK well. Tell me. What's happening? Why do you think? It's unsafe. It's not in a disrespectful. Manner, because if a nurse has a concern that we need to hear about it and we need to support them and it's not 4. To 1, nothing supports said, don't. Tell me there's no guidance. There is. California and Oregon has it. There is there's peer reviewed science, right? You and I have advanced degrees. I did my Masters degree and I had to create a paper. I know there's tons out there about, you know, what safe staffing is and what. That looks like, so stop. It's the hospital associations. It's these people who are testifying against. Us that are causing every other nurse to be assaulted. That's two an hour. 30% of us leave our degrees the first year, up to 60% leave our degrees, not go to another unit, not go to another facility. Walk away from a nursing degree.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah, that is it. That's what spurred this whole podcast of mine was hopefully supporting nurses, so they don't feel like they have to leave. It's hard. Nursing school is hard. Passing boards is hard, and once you get. That we would love to have people stay in that profession, but I also, on the other hand, understand why people leave because of the dysfunctional system that we're in.

    Maggie Ortiz

    And and nurses are realizing more and more. I mean, I could speak for myself, like the first five years. I I wasn't really looking up. I started in the unit. So I was drowning in critical care knowledge. You know what I mean? I didn't. I didn't realize that I was in a business. I thought I was in, you know, in the health. World, I thought. I was doing, you know, a public servant. Then it comes to. Version now 2 decades and now I have no illusion.

    And I came from procedural areas where.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I have no illusion. It's about the dollar. So it's just, but we have to support one another. We do have the tools. Are there going to be systems that crumble? Yes, there are. Are there those places that closed? Yes, there are thousands. Thousands will crumble because they were ignoring us. But we can't own that. We can't own that.

    Beth Quaas

    Right.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Their lack of planning and their mistreatment. Us too bad. So sad. Again. Do I want to see these crumble? No. Do I want to see rural hospitals or long term care facilities? close. I do not. But we're going to have to restructure pay staffing. All these things that they've ignored, that they've treated us like the room rate. Like, you know, Rebecca Love often talks about.

    They did this to us.

    Maggie Ortiz

    They have dismantled us and and let greed come into our environment. But Big farm medical devices, greed, health insurance companies.

    I mean, where does it?

    Maggie Ortiz

    So no, stop nurses, we support one another. We stand with one one another.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah. And those for those of us that have been in it for. A while like you and I, we. We were caught off guard. I'm we're here taking care of patients and then all of a sudden it's. What do you mean? I have to do more with less. And I still only have these two hands in this 8 hours or 12 hours or 16 hours. I what? What do you want to give? And unfortunately, I think we know where we had to cut back. And that was sometimes. Of patient care or our own health. And neither of those are good.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Correct. Or both? Or both?

    Beth Quaas

    Yes, absolutely.

    Maggie Ortiz

    And we're not all the tools. These nurses. Again, I wasn't working in the ICU, so during COVID, I was working in the Cath lab. But we all know that there were nurses that were literally zipping body bags, many of them up an hour. And what do we do to support their mental health? What did we do to support them? We were telling the doctors you don't got to go in. You can copy their notes. But Nursery will go in you. Will be with them when they. Take their last breath. There's not going to be enough. Enough for youth. I mean, that was. The breaking and that that, that. Broke a lot of people when they came. For me, I had been practicing for over 2 decades when they came in and took the N95 mask. I lost my mind. I had already been, you know, the border nursing stuff. All of this stuff. I had already been down this road, so I already knew the abuses. But then when they came in and they took the only thing that would protect me as a nurse, my brother's a firefighter. You would never walk into the fire. They should take his fire retarding gear. You would never walk into. The Police Department and take their bulletproof stuff. You would never do this to the military, yet you came into my environment and you.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Took an N95 mask. How dare. Do how and then and then you only pass workman's comp for 13 States and Texas wasn't one of them. I beg my representatives representative movie out of the South Texas trying to get US workman's comp. So any near anyone, and not just a nurse, and I don't want to be circle anesthesia providers, right? They're intimately involved. You know yourself. You know what I mean? Us. We're the ones standing there and then. For you not to give healthcare providers workman's comp.

    Beth Quaas

    I it made me so angry that when I heard that, well, if you don't have the PPE you nurses, you can use a. Are you kidding me right now?

    Maggie Ortiz

    A week ago I have been ported to the Board of Nursing. I just want to make sure so if I would have reused that 95 a week ago, I just want to clarify and put on this bandana. I would be standing in front of the board of. Nursing but a. Week later, it's OK. I I just want to verify that. OK, thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. And if I put it in this brown bag, it's magical. A week ago, this brown bag not, but now if I just put it in here 24 hours, it's good. Go. OK, just checking, just checking.

    Beth Quaas

    The facility that I worked at had. That people stand outside of. These supply areas. And you were not allowed in, and there were. Boxes and boxes of PPE available that we were not able to use. We had to put her in 90 fives in a brown bag. We put them at the desk. You couldn't even take. You had to leave it there with your. Name on it. Are you kidding me right now? It's so frustrating.

    Maggie Ortiz

    No, I was. I was beyond myself. I called Texas Department of Emergency Management. I called all my representatives. My Rep dropped mask off on my front door and then when Texas Department Emergency Management wouldn't originally call me back and then I called my representative and gave them their information, then tell them, call me back and said they. Could help me? I was like oh wow interesting.

    Did you just talk to my? Representative, how about? That you can help me now?

    Beth Quaas

    Interesting. We can't affect change. We just have to be able to do it. Know who to go to is.

    Maggie Ortiz

    We'll need some N 90 fives.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Sorry, spell your first and last name of your title. I just want to make sure I get this correct, not disrespectfully. OK. And then the phone number and e-mail and then I call my representative. Please call X. Yep. Here's the number. And then all of a sudden, I.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah, if you just know.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Got a phone call.

    Speaker 3

    Back, I was like, oh, how about that? Nice to talk to you.

    Beth Quaas

    Who the contacts and again, like you mentioned, be professional. And just I like what you say. Could I get your name and could you make sure you spell that correctly? Because then it's serious. I'm taking your name down and I'm going to. Let people know. That we're not getting what we. Need and it. It was a scary time and for all of us and I feel.

    Maggie Ortiz

    It is and that is not funny. It's not laughing and I don't. I don't do that disrespectfully.

    Beth Quaas

    No, absolutely not. But now we can at least look back on it and just. What's laughable is what we were told and what we were made to do, and at that time in, in that day, there was nothing we could do about it. At the time.

    Maggie Ortiz

    It was like the Twilight zone sister. I mean, I even called the person who, like came up.

    Beth Quaas

    It was. With it in.

    Maggie Ortiz

    95 and he's like, no, it's not. It's not more than one. Year. So I was like, OK, I just. Confirming, I mean ever. Literature says that, but I I just want. To make sure about that. Thanks. Thanks so much..

    Beth Quaas

    It they. Yeah, I. It's just crazy what we were told and we all knew better. Look, we went to school. We understand science and what you're telling us just is it didn't change, it didn't change the textbooks, it didn't change the science. But we're not that stupid.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yeah. Yes, yes, yes, yes, I digress. There. We got down to it.

    Beth Quaas

    What you are doing now is helping people. In probably I would will you can tell me probably some of your darkest moments is if you are involved in some sort of litigation.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yeah, and it can be related oftentimes to staffing. They took an unsafe assignment. I'm seeing that more and more and or like the nail or nurses who I don't know if people realize this, but every governor overturned the requirement for in person clinicals during. That portion of. COVID for obvious reasons. So what does that mean? They never have. Nickels, let me say that. Again, So what? What? So what Sims lab? Sure, absolutely. And. Simulation I had to do some research and I. Did find out. I don't know if you knew. This there's a whole association around like nursing Sims. That the education.

    Beth Quaas

    Yes, I did.

    Maggie Ortiz

    That the research does support that this is there is a a place for this, and the research is profound. And I was impressed. But that also I. Think needs to be in conjunction with. If you know some real life stuff so where when this was decided. So what did the governors do? Did they get with the boards of nursing? Did they get with the National Council of State Boards of Nursing? Did the nursing schools get involved? So now we have these nurses who come down, come out. And So what was the plan? And so they haven't had any simulation. So we already hearing all over. Social media that it's a. Gift to get orientation or training. So what was the plan? And I and I'll wait. I mean, please come back to me. What was the? Plan. I'm sorry. Did National Council, state boards? Of nursing getting. Involved after the governor put this out and then get. To put out something that said, hey, every board of nursing you need to do XYZ, any nursing school because we know that nurses are coming out and don't have the proper right education, training and knowledge. So we're making sure that they all have a nursing residency. I'm seeing nurses in a residency program being peer reviewed. You don't have a peer.

    What's this?

    Maggie Ortiz

    If you're in a nursing residency program, that means that you're a nurse less than a year. This couple of them like less than three months. You you don't have a peer. None of us. You you have no experience.

    Maggie Ortiz

    You you don't have a peer and I have begged them, you know, because they reach out to me back. I just give them some guidance and stuff. I'm like, please go to the CNO. The CNO knows that there's a peer review, doesn't know that. So a nurse that's been a nurse for 5 minutes, they're going to get the report after this is done. And but, you know, she's doing all kinds of other stuff, right? She just knows that there's a peer review, but that's not appropriate. That's not appropriate.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah. And and that's part of why nurses leave the bedside so early on is because they weren't supported. They didn't.

    Maggie Ortiz

    They feel unconfident, they think I wanna show up and feel incompetent. Do you think I wanna show but hurt someone? And it's by no other reason why I haven't been getting the orientation. I'm hearing nurses saying in the unit and I you grew up in it, right? Did you grow up in ICU?

    Can you imagine telling me that?

    Maggie Ortiz

    They get like 4 weeks or sometimes no are being. Sent to the unit to the ICU, sister to the unit. And or saying like it's a. Gift that they get three months, I'm like. Are you kidding? Me. No, let me read you, Texas, where it says that it is the organizations responsibility to make sure that I have the education, training and knowledge. Not like that. It's also mine. It's also mine. And if this organization is not investing in me, I want nurses to realize that you're magical. That door swings both ways. There's not enough of us. And if they're not willing to invest in you, if I was a new nurse, I'd be like, yes, I'm actually interviewing you.

    Do you have a nursing residency program and tell?

    Me. What that? Looks like and if you don't, bye bye cause you're not willing to support me until I'm moving myself along. You don't deserve me. And and and all my know. College nurses need to realize that it's. Not a gift. It's their duty to us.

    Not only that.

    If they don't realize that our orientation, training and knowledge helps prevent litigation because you know what? I know where. Is now at. The crash card, you know what I know. Where is now I have. Access to the Pixies, you.

    Know and now that patient got that? A dentist.

    Seeing that I didn't have to wait 15 minutes for. Right. It's not, it's just. Common sense that the more education training that knowledge. That I have that I'm going to. Be a better asset to the to the team. And then just this one little gold nugget that I always remind nurses is the first thing that subpoenaed in any court of law. One of the first things I talked about, the medical record will then be your employee file. And if you don't have the education, training and knowledge, because we all get that checklist that we have to to check off. And you know why, that's their their protection. Do they care for or oriented to a certain degree? But by God, we're going to have that. Checklist filled out because. That protects them. Right. Oh, no, no. She got training. Nope. Nope. There it is right there. December 9th. Whatever it is. No, no, no, no. It's not on us. Right, so you need to make sure that I need the education, training and knowledge to be on that unit.

    Beth Quaas

    That is such good advice, because when you nonchalantly sign your initials that, Yep, I was oriented to that you better mean it. You better have gotten what you needed and do not be afraid to say. I need a little more. I didn't get what I need. I don't feel comfortable yet. It's your license.

    Maggie Ortiz

    In, in a respectful manner. Right. That's, you know, you go to the chain of command. You go to the chart. Nurse. And then you just say I I can't be floated. I've been here for 5 minutes. You know I can't go anywhere else. You know that. I am a baby nurse and I bring nothing to the table. And I'm not saying that disrespectfully, but I can't leave this unit. I'm literally.

    Speaker 3

    I've even got my orientation boxes. Checked off yet? Where would I be going? No. No, no, no.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Because I could harm a patient. No. And then?

    Speaker 3

    The thing is, when you're floating, you're saying.

    Maggie Ortiz

    That you are comfortable in your own setting because when I go to another floor, I know, you know I where's my pixus access? Where's the crash cart? Where's the bathroom? How do I? Who's on call for surgery? Like, who do you guys call here? Where is that? Who who's? Where's the hook? How's this working you? I bring more to the table and that's only because of time. That's nothing else. But just time. That's not magical. That's any one of us. Do you spend some time in any area? You become an expert just by years in that area and then you know what you can need to ask for because when you go to areas, you even know what you don't know and then you. Can't put up your right hand and say they made me float. No, they didn't, nurse. And then they're going quote to the Nurse Practice Act where it said you violated that. So now did show us in writing or somewhere you. Said you needed the education training knowledge. Go ahead, show us.

    Beth Quaas

    And is that hard? Awkward the first couple times you do that? Absolutely. Does it make you? Does it make people maybe talk about you? Maybe. But should you care?

    Maggie Ortiz

    Because they don't come to me anymore, right? And I say no respect what manner? So are you asking me to violate 217? 1S TSOS is you making. That assignment and T made accepting that assignment and then the definition of medical malpractice is knowing lonely. They're like what? And then did you read the chain of command? You said you're the charge. Nurse. Well, I will. Never be the charge nurse, but. You know that you put yourself. In the administrative chain of command, when you decide to be charged. I digress, but so are you still asking me to take that? OK. OK. I thought so. I'll. Take my two patients in the unit. OK. Thanks.

    Beth Quaas

    Maybe you are a wealth of knowledge and I wish I knew a fraction of what you did. But I am so happy that you're doing what you're doing and you are so good at it. I hope everyone. Follows you and asks for your expertise when they need it. Tell us where people can find you.

    Maggie Ortiz

    So I don't get crazy. It's all advocates. For nurses #4 for@gmail.com. Like you said, I put my number out there. 512-766-8945. You can text or call me. Please don't hesitate to reach out to me and contact. Me on every. Social media platform you could think of. I have videos out there that I've had nurses e-mail me or comment say because. You taught me this or said this now. My unit has. Changed because I got with some other nurses and that's what I want. I want. You to find. The wolf nurse in your hospital, in your unit. And then I want you guys to all. Unite. I want you to. Use a policy. I want you to use the rules and regulations and go to your leadership in a respectful. Manner and make change on your own unit.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah, I love that. I love what you're doing and you are making real change in nursing. So thank you for that.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Thank you. Thank you, sister.

    Beth Quaas

    Thanks for being on the podcast today and I know that we will be having you back again because you just have too much to share in one episode.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I love to. I love to educate my people so absolutely. And then anyone who's listening for your listeners, I will do. I'll send you a code for 30% off for. That charting course, because that is hands down, because the first thing I'm going to ask a nurse when I look at the record is I'm going to use the medical record, right. And what you do or do not document. Doesn't matter so. Let me teach you how to do this.

    Beth Quaas

    Thank you. We'll put that in the show, notes, Maggie. That is very generous of you. I appreciate it.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Absolutely. You're gonna see.

    Beth Quaas

    Also, even better. Thanks for your time today, Maggie, I. Really appreciate it.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Absolutely. Absolutely, always. Good to hear from you.

    Beth Quaas

    Thank you.

    Beth Quaas

    Hello everyone and welcome back to don't eat. You're young. I'm your host, Beth cross. I am so happy that you're here today to listen. And I encourage you to go on to wherever you listen to this podcast and leave a review for me. Your rating? I would be so appreciate. Today I'm so excited to have Maggie Ortiz back on the show. She was here last season and I'm so excited to bring her back. She's doing so much to encourage nurses and educating them on their rights and their protections and where they can go if they need help. So I welcome back to the show. Maggie Ortiz. Maggie, it is so nice to have you back again. Tell us what you've been doing.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Well, always nice to be back. So where to begin? Where to begin? I actually had a pretty great year. I, you know, this is my first month. 2023 was my actual. Just like first year being out there as an entrepreneur, as a next entrepreneur, which can be kind of scary. I mean leaving. The bedside I could save. A life. But some of this.

    Other Techy stuff or getting out there.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Can be a little bit more difficult, but I've had I've been well received. Wrote a book help. I'm a nurse. I'm being deposed. That one kindle. Amazon. Is it the end ought to be all. It's not. And I didn't realize that there were some. You know difficulties. With getting that on Amazon and having that you know. Just touching it and. Getting it to a nurse and you have to have Kindles. A lot of learning curves there, but it is on Amazon because when a nurse comes to me and they're in civil litigation, which is different than administrative and criminal, we're we're not talking because you're not saying my name within the first five to seven, 7 minutes of your deposition. Who prepped you? No, that's your legal team's responsibility, not mine. But it can be scary for a nurse. 'Cause, they don't know what. What's a plaintiff? What's the defense? What superiors respondents. So I just break it down with just definition. So it's an educational piece for a nurse. You know, throwing some weighty stuff, some stats because, you know, people want to know that stuff and then tying it a little bit too, like, it could also end up in front of a board of nursing. But I'm not a lawyer. I never give legal. Advice but it's. Just my way of trying to give a nurse. You know something in 20 pages that they can use, you know the. Risk manager reached out to them. Hey, no big deal.

    Come on down. Here there's a legal case that you're involved in. No, no biggie. Don't sweat it. And they're like, wait, what?

    Beth Quaas

    Remind us. So you had a very short stint on the Texas Board of Nursing as an investigator. Remind us a little bit about that period and how it brought you to what you're doing now.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Sure. So great question, great question. So that is what kind of brings me to advocates for nurses. Advocate Maggie, is that I did spend a short period of time as an investigator and I was seeing some things that I concerns about. I didn't know law. I wasn't. I was trained as an investigator, but I was like, oh, I'm so how many staff were there? No, no, no, no. Just, you know, keep moving forward. I just felt like nurses. You know, and I'm skipping over lots of stuff there. We're not being extended. What I now know, a decade later, to be due process, and I'm not the only one who speaks up about this. So I spent a short time there, came back on out, went back to the Cath lab. I was comfortable. US legal nurse consultant reached out to me and said, hey, I have a civil case. Would you look at it? And I was like, yes, full transparency. So then I crossed over, became civil expert for short period of time and now I do administrative expert work or advocacy where I help nurses and their legal teams when they're under investigation. So just under administrative law, which is any. A person with a license. It's your privilege to practice it. Doesn't this have to be a traditional board? It could be HHS, DHS, the governor, ALJ. Just I have become intimate with that process and it changed my life. So I'm. I'm just called. To this space. To help educate our people so you understand the Board of Nursing. Its mission is not. To protect us, it's to protect the public.

    Beth Quaas

    I I love that I love the work that you're doing and you freely give up your phone number to nurses to reach out to you at any.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I do just because I'm. I'm called to something bigger than myself, and when they're sleeping in their car or they get that letter, it's like getting a cancer diagnosis. Right. And it's it's can be very nerve wracking. So yes and sometimes. You know their legal team as well only has a certain amount of time that they can spend with them. No disrespect to the lawyer. I'm. I'm going to be going to law school, but their time is limited and or their knowledge of the Board of Nursing because maybe they're not a nurse. I have a different knowledge base. I've had lawyers reach out to me because I was with an agency. So what I had to learn as an investigator with an agency is very different. So I created tools for nurses, some handouts as well about being under investigation. And one of those gifts I do give them is my phone number because. I don't want them. To struggle alone. It can be very scary. And you know anyone who's been in this a. Nurse for a hot minute. We see. These people's names in the quarterly magazine or handout and. We all make assumptions. As did I prior to spending some time at that board, are there nurses in that hand out that did stuff? Yes. Not why? I'm not going to say no. But do they deserve a due process? They do, and that's where I come in. And sometimes it's just knowing what does it mean to be under investigation? What are my rights. And so that's my gift to nurses to help them, you know, along with the group and then doing my tick tocks cause that's the last place I want you to be, but yes. My e-mail phone number. Yes. Please don't. Don't struggle alone. You are not alone.

    Beth Quaas

    So when that nurse like you mentioned gets that call from HR. Come on down. We just want to have a conversation. What's your number? One piece of advice to that nurse?

    Maggie Ortiz

    It will be on your schedule. It will not be while you're on the clock and then you need to have the full access to the full medical record. The organization is not your friend to a certain degree, but they're also don't want to be involved in. Litigation, right. So they're that door for them, swings both.

    Ways that to.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Protect themselves, but they don't want you to be.

    Involved because that involves them.

    Maggie Ortiz

    You know, So what does that mean? So, but you have rights like if you're involved in something, then yes. I want to look the medical record. And it's not gonna be why I'm on the clock. Because you're not gonna rush me. You're not gonna sit here and rush me? No. I will be sitting down there and then if? You open up the medical record. As the nurse, what's the first thing you're doing? You're going into writing a note. I'm reviewing this medical record. For what? What is the case number, Sir? Because if.

    They if you're.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Being deposed, it's there's a petition. It's there's a. There's a case. There's nothing wrong with that. You're just. Keeping it very. Unbiased opening medical record to review for deposition and whatever number that is sitting here with. I'm sorry. What's your name? All the where, Jack?

    Yes, yes, but.

    Maggie Ortiz

    And that's when I'm writing and then I'm. I'm. Then I'm going through the medical record. What is I I. Want to see the? Petition as well as the nurse. What is a petition? The petition is like an allegation or a claim. Why is there a case is basically what that means. So if you're under, if you're being called. Down and there's you're gonna possibly depose. Don't you want to know? The case is about possibly or where originated from, so it is. Your right to. Have that petition, so I would be asking for a petition and sure.

    Yes, attorney Jake. When I'm off, I. Will be more than happy.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I am off on Tuesday. At this time, and I'll be. More than happy. To come down to your office, yes. Sir and you? Don't. This is just for you to review. A medical record? Not for you to say. Oh, you're being opposed. Ohh no I'll let. You know when I'm ready for. That that will be on my schedule as well. Thank you, Jake.

    Beth Quaas

    That is such good advice because. I would say, well, years ago when I was less experienced, I probably would have run right down and answered anything they wanted and said, Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I can't believe this happened and. You're saying slow down. Take your time. It's really your schedule.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yes. Yeah. And I think I would have been the same and a lot of nurses do the same thing and that's you. Know not to go. Back to the book. But that's why I talk about is what it was. Even when you're being. Asked a question. You're always in control. This needs to be under what you are comfortable with, right? It's OK for you to ask the. Attorney. So I don't really understand what this means.

    Can you just help me walk?

    Maggie Ortiz

    And and what are my rights? Do I have rights? You do. And that you need to understand but. When there's a medical malpractice case that's civil litigation, different from administrative, which is the board of Nursing. Differ from CRM. You know, those don't necessarily just because there's a civil case doesn't necessarily mean that the board of Nursing case and or that there's a criminal case, but do know that they can originate from that civil case. If you are found negligent in that civil case and what you do and are not say in that deposition. Right can cross over to the border nursing. And if you are found negligent. And civil, you do under most instances have to close that. And what does that look like normally under your renewal it will ask you a question about. Possible litigation to include civil. And so that's where they. Get you is on your renewal or your full endorsement when you go to another state.

    Beth Quaas

    Well, that's good to know. So at what point? When you maybe ask to come down, you know, like you said, the hospitals, the facilities, the nursing homes, wherever you work, they have lawyers and at what point do you need your own representation outside of that facility?

    Maggie Ortiz

    Tells you. You tells me you recognize. That there is a. Conflict of interest, and that's a great question. So am I the primary nurse or did I just do a? Blood sugar on. That patient, that's the only reason why my name. Is in the chart. If I'm the primary nurse and that patient is now deceased. I would be really I would be going down to speak to the lawyer on my time and it may need. You may need a day or two because it's it's very nerve wracking and that's OK that's OK you need to do this on. Your own schedule their. Lack of planning is. Not your emergency. The trial could be pushed back. There's lots of things. Don't worry about the timeline. If you need a week even to digest that before you have the nerve to even walk into HR. Wherever the. Lawyer lives. That's OK. So then you go down and you speak to. Them it's going if. Even a nurse for 5 minutes going. To come to. Fruition what this is looking. Like I only just fill this out to you. Patient died. You were the last one to touch the patient. There's lacks of lacking documentation. I would probably be thinking about getting my own legal counsel. Because who's cutting that lawyer? That check if you have medical malpractice, or if you have liability insurance, it will get you a medical malpractice lawyer and administrative lawyer. But again, for the most part, that. Hospital organization doesn't want to see you go down because then that ties them to some negligence because you are their employee. And that can you know that can be right to this level of gross negligence. So are they trying to necessarily always throw you over under the bus? No. But when it comes down to the nutcracking, it comes down to you or them who do you. Think they're gonna let you fall? Who? Who? Who's going to fall right and then? You need to take those things into consideration. And then you know, I can't give you the answer to that necessarily, but I hope that you start to realize that you know, I was the last person to touch the patient. This person is no longer here. You know, I have all these physicians here that are called and they have lawyers and they're going to be testifying against me. I I might want to have my own legal representation.

    Beth Quaas

    And I think that's something. If someone were to get in touch with you that you would help them navigate that time and and when to move forward with something like that.

    100%.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Absolutely. Because and even sometimes the things that you do or do not say, because that can actually be, you know, sent right over to the board of nursing, right. And what can be taken extrapolate that because you're in front of a jury, it's theater in civil cases, right? Because not everything is going to be admissible different than the Board of Nursing. So you said some stuff that could be taken out of context. All the evidence was, you know, provided there and now that deposition is literally copied and pasting this public record. Sent over to the Board of Nursing. So I just remind nurses, you know, you're speaking with the lawyer.

    Maggie Ortiz

    You're setting up a time to speak with them to go over. The medical record if. At the time you decide that you want your own legal representation, that's when. You would let the. Hospital lawyer know I'm going to get my own legal representation. Then you put things on pause and then that's when you. You know, get with that lawyer and then you guys are going to go over the medical record or anything. Evidence based science, that's when you would want the full complete file, whatever they have any discoverable. Evidence so discoverable means anything that the other side has to include. That expert nurse is going to be testifying against you. All of it. So that you get that you can review that before you are deposed.

    Beth Quaas

    That's great information. And if nothing else, just to have somebody totally on your side. Yes, it wants to help you and and not like we said, not that the hospital doesn't want to help you. But again they have their own things to protect.

    Correct, correct.

    Beth Quaas

    Well, I'm so excited that you are going back to school to become a lawyer because. There cannot be too many nurses in this country that also have their JD do you, is that correct?

    Maggie Ortiz

    I believe so, I I. Couldn't spew that number off the top of my head, but I don't believe it's a huge number. I don't believe there's a huge number of women. And what are we predominantly women, so. That there it. Is so yeah, it's have to do it.

    Beth Quaas

    I love that. What? What a gap. That you will fill and you know. Will you know the Board of Nursing and how they run? At least in Texas. And I know that you've done research on other states as well and you are a wealth of information. So to have someone in that space that knows what we do is going to be. So fantastic.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I do think that there is a deficiency and that is the other reason that spurred me, you know, was an ER Doctor Who? Was just like. Us what are you waiting for? And. I was like well. So the ill set and he was like this. The test he was like, stop.

    And I was like, well, I'm. I'm old, I'm.

    Maggie Ortiz

    50 he's like I'm 73. So next what? What? Was your answer and I was like, alright, I he was like you. Were called to this space you already. Doing the work. So it's it. Is time, so I it is time.

    Beth Quaas

    What grassroots things are you working on right now?

    Maggie Ortiz

    So I'm doing some charting courses and teaching nurses and charting stuff just because like I just talked about. You're sitting in front with the lawyer, and now we're looking at what did I just say? The documentation what you did. Or did not document so I got I'm I'm. Able to do. CE for the charting courses that I'm doing, so I'm doing like charting Tuesday in January and then teaching class at 7:00 PM Central Standard Time just because. And that's what I that's what nurses keep asking me for is the documentation course, because what do I know in all three types of litigation? What's the one thing that we're going to look at and not necessarily for a criminal case, but if it was related to, like, a medication error that led to? Possibly a death. What are we all going to look at? The medical records what you did or did not? Document and then with the you know with just with COVID and then these nurses not getting some of the real time ability to to like chart for you know in an EMAR or on paper because they. Were in SIM. Labs. So there's that, you know, huge deficiency. The nursing Coalition I completed that this year, getting nurses together to brainstorm because again, we're trying to find some grass. Stuff to hold some boards accountable. So still working on some of that, I collaborated with some great nurses and learned some stuff and it's every state, just like you said. I've helped either an attorney or a nurse in every, you know, single state. Some are worse than others. So collaborating with some other people because it. Can't just be me. It has to be, you know, 5 or 10 people in each state and then you know. We, like we talked about, we are 5. Million strong. We can make change. But it has to be each one of us going to our representatives. So I created some tools like how do I reach my representative? Well, OK, just Google, who represents me. So I created some of those tools on my website with some short, like maybe a direct message or an e-mail that you can just copy and paste and kind of draft just a little bit. Change to send to your representative. So that's something that I created.

    Beth Quaas

    That's so incredible for nurses to have that, so that they know what to do and. A personalized written message goes a long way versus. Just clicking on something that is generic and and I've seen it work and so I love what you're doing because it really does help. And like you said, 5 million, we can make things happen.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yeah, and it was a in Texas here and I don't know the bill they passed where an APR has to be called if an APR is under investigation.

    Beth Quaas

    Really, 2023?

    Maggie Ortiz

    So those kind of things do. Matter. I'm just going. To leave that there, but it wasn't. A PR group that had their lobbyist, you know, champion and that kind. Of stuff, but it it. Will take. All of us. It cannot just be one of us. So just like you said, people don't underestimate our people, underestimate the power of our representatives. Because all you have to say is. Hey, I'm your. Constituent and you know who I'm like to hit up first is the nurses and the physicians because they they're our peers. You stand in front of them and you tell them I was zipping someone up every hour and a body bag, a body bag last year and I didn't get workman's comp or and or every other nurses assaulted. And that's two an hour and there's no bill. In the. State why? Why is that? You know, the Dallas nurse that got shot in the face, the social worker, and we don't have, you know, metal detectors. But by God, the Dallas Stadium does tell me about that.

    Beth Quaas

    I love that yes. Why is that? Why is that?

    Maggie Ortiz

    It's all optics and you know what it is? It's not about us and only. Take the nurses. Out of it. How about the patients? You know, that was a. Labor and delivery. Room in Dallas. The labor and delivery unit in Dallas, right, and this and no disrespect this, this young man.

    Beth Quaas

    I remember that story.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Had an ankle bracelet on and I'm not saying you should be able to see your child, but not at the hospital. You've made some choices in your life, right? And again, there are people at risk here and because of that, that isn't you're then you're not able to come in this building right now. What you guys do when she goes. Home here. You know, in a day or two is, you know, but you don't get to come. In this building, right? That's just how it works, and had that been in place. He would have lurked it. He had a gun on him, right? And then maybe some of that. Stuff you know. That, that, that. They would be here today.

    Beth Quaas

    Completely agree and they tried to pass legislation in Minnesota with staffing ratios and. It throughout the hospitals in Minnesota and it didn't make it through because one of the well, the biggest health system in Minnesota, threatened to take a big expansion outside of our state. And so it was shot down. So that tells you, is it about the money or about the patient?

    Maggie Ortiz

    Science. It's all science, and there's not one study that supports not having enough of us. I can tell you. On the civil. And the Board of Nursing side failure to respond. Let me just tell you about that. And now I had, you know, four patients in the ICU. And you and I both. Know that's not appropriate. You know you have a. Nurse that says. You know, I have four patients in the unit. Try responding to someone who's maxed out on pressors. I'm in this other room with this. Other patients unstable, they're maxed out on pressers. I should be two to one instead of four to one, and now I miss something and they have a bad outcome. And now that family reports me every nurse I want you to know. You cannot say. My hospital made me. No, they did not. And I don't, I don't, you know, again, easy for me to say, but let me just tell you their nurses who got their ankle bracelets off right. And if they can't, if that. Hospital cannot staff that. Unit and or that facility I can assure you they're still doing elective cases. I can assure you they've not gone in diversion. I can assure you they've not moved anyone where they need to be. So don't. Tell me they've exhausted all the rest. Courses no, because you're placing me and my license and my ability to. Support my family. At risk, your lack of planning, we're here. Because of them. Right. And we have to stop normalizing.

    That right there.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I use things like 217 one S&TSOS is you making me making the assignment tease me accepting the assignment. Are you asking me? To do that, the. Definition of medical malpractice and I'll. Both the Texas Nurses Association lawyer whom said I. Asked this question. Knowingly and willingly taking on an unsafe assignment is that the definition. Of medical malpractice, it sure is. Don't tell me that they're making you, because again, they're not and my.

    Beth Quaas

    Mic drop.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Biggest thing is that you. Have to be part of the solution. What did the schedule say? 30 days ago. How long did you know? And I'm not telling you that some of the stuff I'm telling you is right. I'm just telling you where you are, right? Now and you have. To introduce yourself to the position that they put us in and us too, because. We too have stood by and done nothing. We have to own. Our piece of it. As well, we have stood by and just been like because we're the moms. We're the sisters, we're the nurses of. World, we're just. We just want to show up and do good things and then we just expect everyone else around us to like, do the right thing and then, you know, we didn't go to the Capitol, we didn't. You know, there's only small part of us who were willing to do those kind of things that make change. So part of it we do have to own where we are at as well. But then. That being said. Now every one of us has to stand up and say. No, we don't shame other nurses on the floor. We all stand united if one of us has. A concern all. Of us has concerned we don't isolate any of us because even it it may not even be valid, right? It could be something so ridiculous, but then. That's when education. You take their hand. You're like, OK well. Tell me. What's happening? Why do you think? It's unsafe. It's not in a disrespectful. Manner, because if a nurse has a concern that we need to hear about it and we need to support them and it's not 4. To 1, nothing supports said, don't. Tell me there's no guidance. There is. California and Oregon has it. There is there's peer reviewed science, right? You and I have advanced degrees. I did my Masters degree and I had to create a paper. I know there's tons out there about, you know, what safe staffing is and what. That looks like, so stop. It's the hospital associations. It's these people who are testifying against. Us that are causing every other nurse to be assaulted. That's two an hour. 30% of us leave our degrees the first year, up to 60% leave our degrees, not go to another unit, not go to another facility. Walk away from a nursing degree.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah, that is it. That's what spurred this whole podcast of mine was hopefully supporting nurses, so they don't feel like they have to leave. It's hard. Nursing school is hard. Passing boards is hard, and once you get. That we would love to have people stay in that profession, but I also, on the other hand, understand why people leave because of the dysfunctional system that we're in.

    Maggie Ortiz

    And and nurses are realizing more and more. I mean, I could speak for myself, like the first five years. I I wasn't really looking up. I started in the unit. So I was drowning in critical care knowledge. You know what I mean? I didn't. I didn't realize that I was in a business. I thought I was in, you know, in the health. World, I thought. I was doing, you know, a public servant. Then it comes to. Version now 2 decades and now I have no illusion.

    And I came from procedural areas where.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I have no illusion. It's about the dollar. So it's just, but we have to support one another. We do have the tools. Are there going to be systems that crumble? Yes, there are. Are there those places that closed? Yes, there are thousands. Thousands will crumble because they were ignoring us. But we can't own that. We can't own that.

    Beth Quaas

    Right.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Their lack of planning and their mistreatment. Us too bad. So sad. Again. Do I want to see these crumble? No. Do I want to see rural hospitals or long term care facilities? close. I do not. But we're going to have to restructure pay staffing. All these things that they've ignored, that they've treated us like the room rate. Like, you know, Rebecca Love often talks about.

    They did this to us.

    Maggie Ortiz

    They have dismantled us and and let greed come into our environment. But Big farm medical devices, greed, health insurance companies.

    I mean, where does it?

    Maggie Ortiz

    So no, stop nurses, we support one another. We stand with one one another.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah. And those for those of us that have been in it for. A while like you and I, we. We were caught off guard. I'm we're here taking care of patients and then all of a sudden it's. What do you mean? I have to do more with less. And I still only have these two hands in this 8 hours or 12 hours or 16 hours. I what? What do you want to give? And unfortunately, I think we know where we had to cut back. And that was sometimes. Of patient care or our own health. And neither of those are good.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Correct. Or both? Or both?

    Beth Quaas

    Yes, absolutely.

    Maggie Ortiz

    And we're not all the tools. These nurses. Again, I wasn't working in the ICU, so during COVID, I was working in the Cath lab. But we all know that there were nurses that were literally zipping body bags, many of them up an hour. And what do we do to support their mental health? What did we do to support them? We were telling the doctors you don't got to go in. You can copy their notes. But Nursery will go in you. Will be with them when they. Take their last breath. There's not going to be enough. Enough for youth. I mean, that was. The breaking and that that, that. Broke a lot of people when they came. For me, I had been practicing for over 2 decades when they came in and took the N95 mask. I lost my mind. I had already been, you know, the border nursing stuff. All of this stuff. I had already been down this road, so I already knew the abuses. But then when they came in and they took the only thing that would protect me as a nurse, my brother's a firefighter. You would never walk into the fire. They should take his fire retarding gear. You would never walk into. The Police Department and take their bulletproof stuff. You would never do this to the military, yet you came into my environment and you.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Took an N95 mask. How dare. Do how and then and then you only pass workman's comp for 13 States and Texas wasn't one of them. I beg my representatives representative movie out of the South Texas trying to get US workman's comp. So any near anyone, and not just a nurse, and I don't want to be circle anesthesia providers, right? They're intimately involved. You know yourself. You know what I mean? Us. We're the ones standing there and then. For you not to give healthcare providers workman's comp.

    Beth Quaas

    I it made me so angry that when I heard that, well, if you don't have the PPE you nurses, you can use a. Are you kidding me right now?

    Maggie Ortiz

    A week ago I have been ported to the Board of Nursing. I just want to make sure so if I would have reused that 95 a week ago, I just want to clarify and put on this bandana. I would be standing in front of the board of. Nursing but a. Week later, it's OK. I I just want to verify that. OK, thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. And if I put it in this brown bag, it's magical. A week ago, this brown bag not, but now if I just put it in here 24 hours, it's good. Go. OK, just checking, just checking.

    Beth Quaas

    The facility that I worked at had. That people stand outside of. These supply areas. And you were not allowed in, and there were. Boxes and boxes of PPE available that we were not able to use. We had to put her in 90 fives in a brown bag. We put them at the desk. You couldn't even take. You had to leave it there with your. Name on it. Are you kidding me right now? It's so frustrating.

    Maggie Ortiz

    No, I was. I was beyond myself. I called Texas Department of Emergency Management. I called all my representatives. My Rep dropped mask off on my front door and then when Texas Department Emergency Management wouldn't originally call me back and then I called my representative and gave them their information, then tell them, call me back and said they. Could help me? I was like oh wow interesting.

    Did you just talk to my? Representative, how about? That you can help me now?

    Beth Quaas

    Interesting. We can't affect change. We just have to be able to do it. Know who to go to is.

    Maggie Ortiz

    We'll need some N 90 fives.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Sorry, spell your first and last name of your title. I just want to make sure I get this correct, not disrespectfully. OK. And then the phone number and e-mail and then I call my representative. Please call X. Yep. Here's the number. And then all of a sudden, I.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah, if you just know.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Got a phone call.

    Speaker 3

    Back, I was like, oh, how about that? Nice to talk to you.

    Beth Quaas

    Who the contacts and again, like you mentioned, be professional. And just I like what you say. Could I get your name and could you make sure you spell that correctly? Because then it's serious. I'm taking your name down and I'm going to. Let people know. That we're not getting what we. Need and it. It was a scary time and for all of us and I feel.

    Maggie Ortiz

    It is and that is not funny. It's not laughing and I don't. I don't do that disrespectfully.

    Beth Quaas

    No, absolutely not. But now we can at least look back on it and just. What's laughable is what we were told and what we were made to do, and at that time in, in that day, there was nothing we could do about it. At the time.

    Maggie Ortiz

    It was like the Twilight zone sister. I mean, I even called the person who, like came up.

    Beth Quaas

    It was. With it in.

    Maggie Ortiz

    95 and he's like, no, it's not. It's not more than one. Year. So I was like, OK, I just. Confirming, I mean every. Literature says that, but I I just want. To make sure about that. Thanks. Thanks so much.

    Beth Quaas

    It they. Yeah, I. It's just crazy what we were told and we all knew better. Look, we went to school. We understand science and what you're telling us just is it didn't change, it didn't change the textbooks, it didn't change the science. But we're not that stupid.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yeah. Yes, yes, yes, yes, I digress. There. We got down to it.

    Beth Quaas

    What you are doing now is helping people. In probably I would will you can tell me probably some of your darkest moments is if you are involved in some sort of litigation.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Yeah, and it can be related oftentimes to staffing. They took an unsafe assignment. I'm seeing that more and more and or like the nail or nurses who I don't know if people realize this, but every governor overturned the requirement for in person clinicals during. That portion of. COVID for obvious reasons. So what does that mean? They never have. Nickels, let me say that. Again, So what? What? So what Sims lab? Sure, absolutely. And. Simulation I had to do some research and I. Did find out. I don't know if you knew. This there's a whole association around like nursing Sims. That the education.

    Beth Quaas

    Yes, I did.

    Maggie Ortiz

    That the research does support that this is there is a a place for this, and the research is profound. And I was impressed. But that also I. Think needs to be in conjunction with. If you know some real life stuff so where when this was decided. So what did the governors do? Did they get with the boards of nursing? Did they get with the National Council of State Boards of Nursing? Did the nursing schools get involved? So now we have these nurses who come down, come out. And So what was the plan? And so they haven't had any simulation. So we already hearing all over. Social media that it's a. Gift to get orientation or training. So what was the plan? And I and I'll wait. I mean, please come back to me. What was the? Plan. I'm sorry. Did National Council, state boards? Of nursing getting. Involved after the governor put this out and then get. To put out something that said, hey, every board of nursing you need to do XYZ, any nursing school because we know that nurses are coming out and don't have the proper right education, training and knowledge. So we're making sure that they all have a nursing residency. I'm seeing nurses in a residency program being peer reviewed. You don't have a peer.

    What's this?

    Maggie Ortiz

    If you're in a nursing residency program, that means that you're a nurse less than a year. This couple of them like less than three months. You you don't have a peer. None of us. You you have no experience.

    Maggie Ortiz

    You you don't have a peer and I have begged them, you know, because they reach out to me back. I just give them some guidance and stuff. I'm like, please go to the CNO. The CNO knows that there's a peer review, doesn't know that. So a nurse that's been a nurse for 5 minutes, they're going to get the report after this is done. And but, you know, she's doing all kinds of other stuff, right? She just knows that there's a peer review, but that's not appropriate. That's not appropriate.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah. And and that's part of why nurses leave the bedside so early on is because they weren't supported. They didn't.

    Maggie Ortiz

    They feel unconfident, they think I wanna show up and feel incompetent. Do you think I wanna show but hurt someone? And it's by no other reason why I haven't been getting the orientation. I'm hearing nurses saying in the unit and I you grew up in it, right? Did you grow up in ICU?

    Can you imagine telling me that?

    Maggie Ortiz

    They get like 4 weeks or sometimes no are being. Sent to the unit to the ICU, sister to the unit. And or saying like it's a. Gift that they get three months, I'm like. Are you kidding? Me. No, let me read you, Texas, where it says that it is the organizations responsibility to make sure that I have the education, training and knowledge. Not like that. It's also mine. It's also mine. And if this organization is not investing in me, I want nurses to realize that you're magical. That door swings both ways. There's not enough of us. And if they're not willing to invest in you, if I was a new nurse, I'd be like, yes, I'm actually interviewing you.

    Do you have a nursing residency program and tell?

    Me. What that? Looks like and if you don't, bye bye cause you're not willing to support me until I'm moving myself along. You don't deserve me. And and and all my know. College nurses need to realize that it's. Not a gift. It's their duty to us.

    Not only that.

    If they don't realize that our orientation, training and knowledge helps prevent litigation because you know what? I know where. Is now at. The crash card, you know what I know. Where is now I have. Access to the Pixies, you.

    Know and now that patient got that? A dentist.

    Seeing that I didn't have to wait 15 minutes for. Right. It's not, it's just. Common sense that the more education training that knowledge. That I have that I'm going to. Be a better asset to the to the team. And then just this one little gold nugget that I always remind nurses is the first thing that subpoenaed in any court of law. One of the first things I talked about, the medical record will then be your employee file. And if you don't have the education, training and knowledge, because we all get that checklist that we have to to check off. And you know why, that's their their protection. Do they care for or oriented to a certain degree? But by God, we're going to have that. Checklist filled out because. That protects them. Right. Oh, no, no. She got training. Nope. Nope. There it is right there. December 9th. Whatever it is. No, no, no, no. It's not on us. Right, so you need to make sure that I need the education, training and knowledge to be on that unit.

    Beth Quaas

    That is such good advice, because when you nonchalantly sign your initials that, Yep, I was oriented to that you better mean it. You better have gotten what you needed and do not be afraid to say. I need a little more. I didn't get what I need. I don't feel comfortable yet. It's your license.

    Maggie Ortiz

    In, in a respectful manner. Right. That's, you know, you go to the chain of command. You go to the chart. Nurse. And then you just say I I can't be floated. I've been here for 5 minutes. You know I can't go anywhere else. You know that. I am a baby nurse and I bring nothing to the table. And I'm not saying that disrespectfully, but I can't leave this unit. I'm literally.

    I've even got my orientation boxes. Checked off yet? Where would I be going? No. No, no, no.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Because I could harm a patient. No. And then?

    The thing is, when you're floating, you're saying.

    Maggie Ortiz

    That you are comfortable in your own setting because when I go to another floor, I know, you know I where's my pixus access? Where's the crash cart? Where's the bathroom? How do I? Who's on call for surgery? Like, who do you guys call here? Where is that? Who who's? Where's the hook? How's this working you? I bring more to the table and that's only because of time. That's nothing else. But just time. That's not magical. That's any one of us. Do you spend some time in any area? You become an expert just by years in that area and then you know what you can need to ask for because when you go to areas, you even know what you don't know and then you. Can't put up your right hand and say they made me float. No, they didn't, nurse. And then they're going quote to the Nurse Practice Act where it said you violated that. So now did show us in writing or somewhere you. Said you needed the education training knowledge. Go ahead, show us.

    Beth Quaas

    And is that hard? Awkward the first couple times you do that? Absolutely. Does it make you? Does it make people maybe talk about you? Maybe. But should you care?

    Maggie Ortiz

    Because they don't come to me anymore, right? And I say no respect what manner? So are you asking me to violate 217? 1S TSOS is you making. That assignment and T made accepting that assignment and then the definition of medical malpractice is knowing lonely. They're like what? And then did you read the chain of command? You said you're the charge. Nurse. Well, I will. Never be the charge nurse, but. You know that you put yourself. In the administrative chain of command, when you decide to be charged. I digress, but so are you still asking me to take that? OK. OK. I thought so. I'll. Take my two patients in the unit. OK. Thanks.

    Beth Quaas

    Maybe you are a wealth of knowledge and I wish I knew a fraction of what you did. But I am so happy that you're doing what you're doing and you are so good at it. I hope everyone. Follows you and asks for your expertise when they need it. Tell us where people can find you.

    Maggie Ortiz

    So I don't get crazy. It's all advocates. For nurses #4 for@gmail.com. Like you said, I put my number out there. 512-766-8945. You can text or call me. Please don't hesitate to reach out to me and contact. Me on every. Social media platform you could think of. I have videos out there that I've had nurses e-mail me or comment say because. You taught me this or said this now. My unit has. Changed because I got with some other nurses and that's what I want. I want. You to find. The wolf nurse in your hospital, in your unit. And then I want you guys to all. Unite. I want you to. Use a policy. I want you to use the rules and regulations and go to your leadership in a respectful. Manner and make change on your own unit.

    Beth Quaas

    Yeah, I love that. I love what you're doing and you are making real change in nursing. So thank you for that.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Thank you. Thank you, sister.

    Beth Quaas

    Thanks for being on the podcast today and I know that we will be having you back again because you just have too much to share in one episode.

    Maggie Ortiz

    I love to. I love to educate my people so absolutely. And then anyone who's listening for your listeners, I will do. I'll send you a code for 30% off for. That charting course, because that is hands down, because the first thing I'm going to ask a nurse when I look at the record is I'm going to use the medical record, right. And what you do or do not document. Doesn't matter so. Let me teach you how to do this.

    Beth Quaas

    Thank you. We'll put that in the show, notes, Maggie. That is very generous of you. I appreciate it.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Absolutely. You're gonna see.

    Beth Quaas

    Also, even better. Thanks for your time today, Maggie, I. Really appreciate it.

    Maggie Ortiz

    Absolutely. Absolutely, always. Good to hear from you.

    Beth Quaas

    Thank you.

Quaas Beth
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